Rampagin' Alien: Panthers send Markstrom to San Antonio, recall Clemmensen
by Donny Rivette on Nov 7, 2011 11:40 AM EST
in Florida Panthers News & Analysis
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PrintThe increasingly expected has ultimately become reality, as the Florida Panthers have reassigned rookie goaltender Jacob Markstrom (4-2-1, 2.05/.944) to the AHL's San Antonio Rampage while recalling a healthy Scott Clemmensen (1GP w/SA; 1-0, 1.00/.969, 31 saves).
Markstrom should see the lion's share of starts with the Rampage, which was highly unlikely had he remained with Florida; he'll combine with fellow prospect Brian Foster as the 1-2 combo for San Antonio.
Clemmer, having completed a one-game rehab assignment, finds himself in a bit of a grey area; with Marky out of the picture for the moment, and in the final year of his three-season contract (typically a positive situation), he clearly has a golden opportunity to increase his value going forward, though the coaching staff has repeatedly stood behind starter Jose Theodore as the organization's number one.
If management is setting Clemmensen up for a trade (can there be any other strategy here?), getting the 34-year old some NHL ice is a key component to any potential deal.
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I know people will complain, but there is very good logic behind this. I seriously doubt they would have received everything they could in a trade had they tried to trade Clem immediately coming back from injury.
I also see no problem in letting the Alien get more playing time in San Antonio rather than riding the pine here. As good as he was for the few games he played, I’m not 100% sold that he is ready for the full NHL schedule and competition. I am looking forward to how good he’ll be next year and for years to come.
by studyaid on Nov 7, 2011 11:49 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
100 percent agreed…nice too that panthers have the depth for once….
by Hawkseye on Nov 7, 2011 1:04 PM EST via iPhone app up reply actions
San Antonio has allowed 33 goals of 305 shots for save percentage of .892, as well as a goals against average of 3.25. It’s better Markstrom play in San Antonio, where he’ll be the number one guy, than in the NHL where he’ll be platooning.
by Alexander Calloway on Nov 7, 2011 1:13 PM EST up reply actions
Pathetic
but typical of a franchise that hasn’t made the playoffs in over 10 years. You ship your best goaltender down to the minors and keep the two worst.
People who defend it say Florida won’t let the season get out of hand if the goaltending flops, or we’re doing this so as to get something for Clem. How much do you think #2 Goalies with bad teams are worth? Correct me if I am wrong, but if I recall there was a large pool of free agent goalies not signed last July. Some of those guys could be available for teams desperate for a goalie.
Trade acquisitions Skille, Sturm, Samuelsson have what 2 or 3 pts combined.
Another 10-12th place finish in the Eastern Conference. More of the usual.
“best goaltender” based on what? 5 games up here and a mediocre season stat wise in AHL last year??? And the only reason the “stat wise” connotation is necessary is because that’s what you base you JT bashing on primarily. So if Marky’s season last year was so so based on stats, why is he clearly “the best goaltender” today?
by MadDog31 on Nov 7, 2011 12:33 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Has FLA done anything right yet, Bill?
Can you offset even a tiny portion of the same-old, same-old “typical of a franchise that hasn’t made the playoffs in over 10 years” refrain with something you feel has been done correctly this season?
Litter Box Cats - Your tarp-free Florida Panthers Colossus
by Donny Rivette on Nov 7, 2011 12:34 PM EST up reply actions
...comments from Dale
“When Jacob comes back,‘’ Tallon said, "he’ll probably be back forever, as far as knowing that he has the ability to play. He showed his true worth in training camp, showed his true worth in the games he played. We have a bright prospect with a great future ahead. That’s what we’re all about. [Goalie] is a position where you can lose your confidence in a hurry then never bounce back. We’re being cautious here and conservative in his development”
CFS93
Check "Three or More's" career stats as well as Clemmer's
Neither is a quality NHL #1 goalie.
Hic sunt fortuna dracones
I should clarify my stance a bit
It’s probably the best move by management, you want to maximize your resources and not give up an asset in Clemmenson. It also doesn’t hurt Markstrom to get regular playing time.
I just don’t care for Theodore (plus I have Markstrom in my fantasy league).
Hic sunt fortuna dracones
Stats have been widely skewed in recent years. Compare Theo’s stats to goalies that played primarily in early 90’s and early 2000’s. He’s right there with almost all of them. Had a couple of bad years right after lockout. Since 2007, he’s been good, higher GAA with Washington for obvious reasons, and save % around .912%………..Can you say Nabakov with Sharks or Ward or MAF?
Trade acquisitions Skille, Sturm, Samuelsson have what 2 or 3 pts combined.
Well Sturm’s played in 6 games for us. Samuelsson hasn’t played one yet, sooo good point there though.
And I don’t care if we get a 6th round draft pick and a cookie for Clemmer, letting him simply hit the waiver wire and get picked up for nothing just so Markstrom can split time with Theo in November is just asinine.
letting him simply hit the waiver wire and get picked up for nothing just so Markstrom can split time with Theo in November is just asinine
Theres the key world. Sky isn’t falling yet.
I’m putting here for reflection later on in the season…. #14 Tomas [Fleischmann] is getting a 40G season. FLASH COUNT: 5G/7A
by RPC on Sep 17, 2011 5:20 PM MDT
Find me on Twidduh And look at my Marmots
by Chris S Roberts on Nov 7, 2011 8:15 PM EST up reply actions
Clemmer has no value w/o any return games to the NHL……So he has to be showcased if any deal is to be made. Ultimately the answer is a J Mark, Theo combo going forward. But in order to deal Clemmer to the Western conference he is going to have to play a few games and show he is healthy and competitive.
pathetic II
Yesterday’s game rekindled so many fond memories of the past ten years. and today’s move verifies that it is time to prepare for the 2012 draft. C’mon Yakupov
Totally
Cause being 8th in the East in November and staying in games completely rekindles the emotions from years past. Give me a break…
Steve Diaz
Twitter - @sdiaz6215
by Sdiaz6215 on Nov 7, 2011 12:48 PM EST via iPhone app up reply actions 5 recs
Funny thing is, this is going to bad Panther team going forward.
by Alexander Calloway on Nov 7, 2011 1:08 PM EST up reply actions
Completely due to the backup goaltender being switched? Because that’s all that has taken place…
Litter Box Cats - Your tarp-free Florida Panthers Colossus
by Donny Rivette on Nov 7, 2011 1:20 PM EST up reply actions
Because of how good the team will be going forward. Kinda like 2007-08 Chicago Blackhawks being the bad Chicago Blackhawks as compared to the team on the ice now.
by Alexander Calloway on Nov 7, 2011 1:26 PM EST up reply actions
Actually the October start has them sitting really well. They need to win 40 games out of 69 to hit the magic 94/95 pt number. Now that may be tough, but add in that some losses will be in ot/so, really 35 wins out of 69 games should do it.
Or keep at this pace of getting 1 point in every game and the number is 84 points… so get the extra point in 10 games and its all good! JUST KIDDING…
by saskpantherfan on Nov 7, 2011 1:23 PM EST up reply actions
Panthers are currently on pace to win 40 games and finish with 91 points. Which is enough for 8th place in the East.
by Alexander Calloway on Nov 7, 2011 1:28 PM EST up reply actions
I am quite certain that THIS team will do it. Just have that feeling for 6th place.
by saskpantherfan on Nov 7, 2011 1:49 PM EST up reply actions
Love to see a in state playoff series too. That would reignite the Panther side of the rivalry. The Lightning already hate us. :)
Seeing Red since 1994.
I don’t know about the rest of Panthers fans, but there’s not a team I detest more than the Lightning.
Steve Diaz
Twitter - @sdiaz6215
I don’t mind the Lightning so much – like us, they get the “Florida Team” BS from those up north, so we have that in common. What I don’t like are the ones – including their broadcast crew – who use the “Stinking” adjective with some form of Panthers/Kittens/Whatever. That’s a bit too much disrespect in my book – and at that point I tend to remind them of the collective win/loss numbers between the two teams. ;-)
For me? Montreal. And Carolina, but not for the ex-Whalers thing.
Litter Box Cats - Your tarp-free Florida Panthers Colossus
by Donny Rivette on Nov 7, 2011 7:36 PM EST up reply actions
+1
I hereby predict Captain Mike Weaver #43 will score 6G 20A -RCR 0G5A 11/7
Be impeccable with your word, don't take anything personally, don't make assumptions, always do your best...
by RPC on Nov 8, 2011 7:22 AM EST up reply actions
Cartoon Characters
I believe Mr. Tallon signed alot of players with strong character. After watching yesterday’s meltdown, which is TOTALLY UNACCEPTABLE by any standards, I wonder if he really signed a bunch of cartoon characters.
A breakdown in one game? Really?
Litter Box Cats - Your tarp-free Florida Panthers Colossus
by Donny Rivette on Nov 7, 2011 11:52 PM EST up reply actions
A Positive Move
Clemmer and Theo are just good enough to keep us in the hunt. Marky is the face of our goaltending future. Clemmer needs 6-8 starts under his belt at the NHL level to be of any value in the trade market. If the Alien stays with the Rampage all year, then we get a Clemmensen in the last year of a contract with something to prove. We could (and I’m sure we will) see Markstrom again this season.
So what some people are saying is that we waive Clemmer have another team pick him up and we get nothing? What if J Mark get’s injured (didn’t he just have knee surgery last year?) and then Foster becomes our backup to Theodore. So then we basically gave away an NHL experienced goalie for nothing and are one injury from Catastrophe. I understand the frustration but really this is a good problem to have. I trust management to make the right moves to better this team.
A lil thunder and a lil lightning is what the Cats are going to bring this year.
by trinidaddy on Nov 7, 2011 12:45 PM EST via mobile reply actions
Goaltending not the cause of the losses...
It really has not. I can only count on one hand where I have thought Theo was out of position…
The problems have been secondary scoring and bad defense.
Also,
We need Sammuelson to get better fast. We need his PP expertise up front.
by Hawkseye on Nov 7, 2011 1:19 PM EST via iPhone app reply actions 2 recs
^This!
Sloppy D and lines 2-4 needing to fall in place in scoring are what’s holding us back. Jose is holding his own. The negative posters here can just give it a bit of a rest, eh. We all love the Alien but unless someone here has been invited to chime in on Tallon, Santos & Dineen meetings I’m thinking they might know what they are doing.
I hereby predict Captain Mike Weaver #43 will score 6G 20A -RCR 0G5A 11/7
Be impeccable with your word, don't take anything personally, don't make assumptions, always do your best...
by RPC on Nov 7, 2011 1:34 PM EST up reply actions
As far as the goalie move… I think it is the right thing on many levels: 1) Gets Markstrom experience and the constant starts he can expect for years to come; 2) Clemmer is capable of being the backup and Theodore is exceeding preseason expectations; 3) Makes San Antonio a happy affiliate, which I think they have been to date, but getting him there will make them so much better.
I suspect that we may see Markstrom back as early as Feb, but at worst next season is not the end of the world. Can’t hurt to get the Rampage into the playoffs and get some North American playoff experience…
On a personal note, was about to order the Markstrom #25 jersey today… still might though…
You could buy a Rampage #25 jersey.
by Alexander Calloway on Nov 7, 2011 1:29 PM EST up reply actions
Unless your’re a Colby Robak fan, I’d suggest buying a #30 Rampage jersey…
by rampagerowdie on Nov 7, 2011 8:42 PM EST up reply actions
How long before he takes #1?
Litter Box Cats - Your tarp-free Florida Panthers Colossus
by Donny Rivette on Nov 7, 2011 11:53 PM EST up reply actions
This is a no-brainer. Any hockey mind that isn’t damaged will tell you this is the right move for the franchise. For those of you who are adamant this team needs Markstrom to stay up to give them the best chance, I ask you this: What are you expecting this team to do if they make the postseason? Do you really think keeping him up this year, on a team that many pundits expected to not even make the playoffs, will benefit him long-term more than dominating play for a full season at a level below NHL play? Wrong. No matter how hard you argue this team needs to “win now” to keep fans interested, you’re wrong. One season of getting swept in the first round of the playoffs is worth MUCH less to the franchise as a whole than several seasons of deep runs or legitimate shots at the Cup, which is what the current management crew is setting up to do.
I’ve been a fan of this team since it came into the league, and I can understand the lamentations and desire to right the ship and quick, but that’s not how it works in the NHL, let alone most leagues that implement a salary cap. Show me another NHL team that went from zero to hero in two years after a big management and roster overhaul, and I’ll show you a flying narwhal replete with winning lottery tickets. In other words, don’t waste your time looking; it doesn’t exist.
Marky’s the future, but the team we have right now is just the concrete in the foundation. And for once, they’re building upwards towards the goal instead of adding another basement.
Boston in 2007–08, after two last place finishes, but I understand what you’re saying.
by Alexander Calloway on Nov 7, 2011 1:56 PM EST up reply actions
Yea, I mean it’s happened, but it’s incredibly rare and rarely does it amount in a deep playoff push.
I’m gonna start calling you Encyclopedia Alex :)
^ 100% agreed
Been a fan since the start too, and as much as I really enjoyed seeing Markstrom play this year, I am going to enjoy it 100 times more next year and going forward.
The truth is (And it has been said a few times already here this morning) that this team is going finish pretty much the same if it is a Theo/Marky or Theo/Clemmer tandem between the pipes. It is the players in front that need to step up or ship out if they are to get into the playoffs. When Upshall, Santo, etc start bulding the twine more consistantly, the wins will happen. Until then, I am OK with a team that gains the point and does not roll over when down and out. Meltdowns aside, this is still the best start since 1999-2000, and we all know what that team did that no team since has…. (Played a playoff game)
by saskpantherfan on Nov 7, 2011 1:56 PM EST up reply actions
Oooooooh…I get it!
Litter Box Cats - Your tarp-free Florida Panthers Colossus
by Donny Rivette on Nov 7, 2011 11:53 PM EST up reply actions
This is purely a hockey move
The alien has nothing but the future and time on his side, Jose really hasn’t been that bad and if competing teams need goaltending depth, they could have a serious look at Clemmer. Honestly I feel that Clemmer will not finish the season in Sunrise so it just gives time for Jacob to polish up in San Antonio. Really nothing terrible with this move and we all saw it coming. But that’s just me.
My WILD guess…. by Feb Clemmer is in LA after the Kings move Bernier to Tampa.
by saskpantherfan on Nov 7, 2011 1:58 PM EST up reply actions
The Jackets need goaltending ASAP, if they get a new GM, so it may not even be that long.
by Alexander Calloway on Nov 7, 2011 3:45 PM EST up reply actions
Without a doubt.
I have that Yzerman is looking to grab someone that will be a long term solution and that he felt that Bernier fits that need. My guess is that LA may be keen to try to get back Purcell maybe… but also may ask for someone like Dustin Tokarski in the package, plus a 1st or 3. Would be an interesting move to see.
by saskpantherfan on Nov 7, 2011 5:41 PM EST up reply actions
More likely, Tampa goes after Schneider in Vancouver and don’t pay a King’s ransom (no pun intended) to get Bernier or Quick. The Jackets are more likely to try and pry one of those two out of the Kings’ organization than Tampa. Mason could be a good long term solution as a back-up in LA, with his contract expiring season after next.
The Jackets have the better farm system too
by Alexander Calloway on Nov 7, 2011 7:07 PM EST up reply actions
My issue is that SA is not doing well. What if Markstrom gets lit up because of a bad team and loses the confidence he gained while playing for a “good-ish” team in the NHL?
Why not have Tho and Markstrom play like they have till now with Markstrom starting some and Theo starting some.
I understand and even to a point agree with the decision, BUT at the end of the day it’s about results. IMO: Markstrom has given us the best if not at least a DAMN good chance to win every game. Why send him down?
For the record, Im tired of the “He’s the future.” argument. Yes he is. But he has shown he could very well be the present as well with his play.
Because Theo has done nothing to lose the number one starting job, and have Markstrom on the bench does nothing for his development. And he’s not going to get lit up in the AHL.
by Alexander Calloway on Nov 7, 2011 4:00 PM EST up reply actions
it has less to do with the fact that he’s the future of the franchise in the blue paint, and more to do with contract setups and waivers this year. There’s no reason to make him ride the pine with the big club when he could be starting in the A, and there’s no reason to just dump Clemmer or Theo because Marky’s ready. Although a lot of fans don’t think so, both Theo and Clemmer are viable pieces to a team and could garner value somewhere. Clemmer and Theo would need to clear waivers, and would almost definitely be claimed, whereas Markstrom can go down and get more AHL experience (let’s remember he doesn’t even have a full season under his belt in a North American league) and not be subjected to being claimed on waivers.
It’s Tallon and Santos’ job to make sure this is a winning team, but in the long run, not the short term. By dumping Theo (who has played just fine) or Clemmer, they’re not paying attention to the long-term health of the club, but rather the short term reward. We’ve had enough of that garbage with this organization over the last decade.
Markstrom will not get lit up down here…The main problems have been inconsistent offense and poor goaltending…Sorry Foster
by rampagerowdie on Nov 7, 2011 8:45 PM EST up reply actions
Hey all, way way off-topic, but just came across this on TSN up here in Canada:
http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=379894
I know this is probably for the best, but I can’t help but be disappointed. The idea of having the #Alien in net all year was really exciting. I like Theo and have always been a fan of Clemmer, but Marky has been outstanding so far. Sadz.
At the end of the day, I want this team to WIN. And if they think Theo/Clemmer can get it done (at least for the next few weeks) then I will be on board. Until we get shutout again. Then it’s on like Donkey Kong.
Based solely on goalies, this is the right move, for now. There should have been a third option in the poll for “Good move, if a Clemmensen trade follows quickly”. In the long run, for a team still looking for chemistry on the bottom three lines and scoring support, having Theo in net long term doesn’t bode well for any playoff hopes for this season. He’s given up three or more goals in five out of nine games and two goals in all the others except the season opening shutout. And one of those two goal games was two goals on 10 shots in 40 minutes of ice time, so most likely lookin at a third goal.
While a team needs to score goals to win, a goaltender needs to keep the puck out of the net to give his chance to compete. Theo isn’t doing that by giving up three goals a game.
Clemmensen needs to be gone by the New Year. Columbus being the most likely destination, with Toronto a close second. Both need a back-up as their current ones just aren’t working out.
We’re all a bit disappointed, but we knew this was coming. For those who think Theo-Clemm is a ticket to missing the playoffs, oh well. We weren’t supposed to make them this year anyways.
Its not like we traded Marky away. We’ll see him again, if not this year definitely next year.
I’m putting here for reflection later on in the season…. #14 Tomas [Fleischmann] is getting a 40G season. FLASH COUNT: 5G/7A
by RPC on Sep 17, 2011 5:20 PM MDT
Find me on Twidduh And look at my Marmots
Plus that, youve got 4 more months of hockey before you can even think about playoffs. Lets not get ahead of ourselves.
I’m putting here for reflection later on in the season…. #14 Tomas [Fleischmann] is getting a 40G season. FLASH COUNT: 5G/7A
by RPC on Sep 17, 2011 5:20 PM MDT
Find me on Twidduh And look at my Marmots
by Chris S Roberts on Nov 7, 2011 8:22 PM EST up reply actions
First, I’m not someone who thinks the playoffs should be a goal for this season, but there are many who do. especially after the Booth trade. The Panthers have tried to give a bit of an impression with some of their press releases in regards to no more high draft picks and the aforementioned Booth trade. And what better time for the organization to make the playoffs, than when the main competition in town at the time of the year, is pretty much trashing their season down the toilet as we speak. And with a new baseball stadium opening in April, the time is now for the organization to win and create interest, after being an aberration for years in the news.
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