Trade: Panthers send Michael Frolik, Alexander Salak to Blackhawks for Jack Skille, OHL Prospect
by Donny Rivette on Feb 9, 2011 9:10 PM EST
in Florida Panthers Transactions
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And so it begins...the Florida Panthers have traded winger Michael Frolik and the rights to goaltender Alexander Salak to Chicago in exchange for Jack Skille, Hugh Jessiman, and David Pacan. Lots more to follow soon.
Skille was drafted on by the Chicago Blackhawks in the first round, seventh overall in the 2005 draft by...Dale Tallon. From Skille's SB Nation player page:
Assets
Is a very good and swift skater. Is a strong, tenacious forechecker with sound offensive instincts. Works hard every shift and wears his heart on his sleeve.
Flaws
Tends to go into prolonged scoring slumps and generally lacks consistency issues in all facets of the game.
Career Potential
Grinding winger with upside.
Skille is a big and fast winger with goal scoring capability. He's run into some bad luck with his low shooting percentage thus far, but should turn it around soon. Skille will look to replace Radek Dvorak as a forechecking winger.
Some info on Pacan from Brock Otten at OHL Prospects:
I thought he looked excellent. He's big and he plays big. Pacan cycled the puck very well and Erie's defenders had a tough time getting it off him. He also knows his role and goes hard to the net looking for loose pucks.
Pacan has some baggage, as he was dismissed from the University of Vermont's hockey team for "a violation of the student-athlete code of conduct." The reason for the dismissal was never brought to light by UVM or Pacan. Pacan then signed with the Niagara Ice Dogs of the OHL.
Pacan's numbers in the OHL - 14 goals and 29 assists for 43 points in 47 games - have an NHLE of the following:
Pacan's upside seems to be that of a checking center.
Hugh Jessiman is a noted draft bust by the New York Rangers - he was drafted far too high (12th overall in 2003) by Glen Sather and has never lived up to his potential. He's a career AHL player that should offer some help to Rochester this season.
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THINK ABOUT WHAT YOU SAY EVERYONE BEFORE YOU START CALLING FOR DALE TALLON'S HEAD.
the trade makes sense… not TERRIBLE, and we get some young kids in return. frolik was not going to excel here. bring in some guys tallon drafted himself and another AHLer to help along some other young kids we’re trying to develop. this is one of many, boys. this is NOT the blockbuster move or the “final piece”. hold your horses.
a little shocked, but no reason to panic
I think we can chalk this one up to ‘never saw it coming’
Frolik was not playing spectacularly and was definitly on the block…and although we probably could have gotten more for Michael, I’m just gonna take a leap of faith in Tallon
Gypsy! Give me your tears! If you will not give them to me, I will take them from you!
by Chris S Roberts on Feb 9, 2011 9:20 PM EST up reply actions
I’m not surprised he got traded, but I wouldn’t have guessed this is what we’d have coming back. Not that I’m complaining about a roster player, a prospect and an AHLer. I just would have been expecting picks. But we can use the bodies here right now.
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At this early stage, ^ what Jeff said.
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by Donny Rivette on Feb 9, 2011 9:22 PM EST up reply actions
I think it’s pretty obvious Tallon loves size and physicality, something Frolik has neither of. Skille and Jessiman are both big bodies, and Pacan is a point a game guy in the OHL and only 19. Let’s settle down a bit… Tallon doesn’t want to be the 8th-10th team in the east the next 2 or 3 years, he wants to be holding the Cup in 4 or 5 years. I’m OK with that.
Still shocked over this, I personally liked Frolik and loved his style of play. He’s having an off year, but still was a big point producer for the team. Wow. Gotta take a breather from this one. And no one is even talking about Salak. He was wrecking it up in Eruope. Wow.
- Go Panthers -
by flpanther360 on Feb 9, 2011 9:20 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
8 goals this year and hasn’t scored since December 17th. Rest of the roster knows that the rest of the season is an audition. Frolik failed.
And Salak was the odd man out of the Clemmensen, Markstrom, Plante, Chevrie rotation.
8 goals this year and hasn’t scored since December 17th. Rest of the roster knows that the rest of the season is an audition. Frolik failed.
He’s shooting 5%. When his shooting percentage regresses to his historical levels he’ll be fine. Historical numbers would give him 15 goals right now.
He didn’t fail, he got unlucky.
Editor of The Copper & Blue, and leader of The Cult Of Hartikainen.
Not sure I understand what you’re trying to say… If historical numbers have him at 15 and he has 8, how is that unlucky? His shots aren’t going in (not that a lot of our forwards’ shots are going in).
He’s generating more shots per game this year, the most in his career.
S/G
2.00…2008-09
2.67…2009-10
3.03…2010-11
He should be scoring more, he’s getting unlucky. For reference, please see:
http://www.mc79hockey.com/?p=2955
http://vhockey.blogspot.com/2009/10/oiler-team-scoring-chances-and.html
http://www.russianmachineneverbreaks.com/2011/02/02/why-future-performance-not-consistency-matters/
Editor of The Copper & Blue, and leader of The Cult Of Hartikainen.
We have a lot of goalies and can spare one right now. Salak is one of the ones who isn’t signed for next year, and more importantly, he’s on loan and we can’t bring him up this season. With Markstrom hurt, we can’t afford to trade Plante or Cheverie if Vokoun’s going to get traded.
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Frolik was my favorite player so I’m disappointed, but I’m OK with it. I had a feeling it was going to happen.
Regardless,
I hope there is more to come on the trade front
Gypsy! Give me your tears! If you will not give them to me, I will take them from you!
by Chris S Roberts on Feb 9, 2011 9:27 PM EST up reply actions
Good Luck & Best Wishes Frolik!
Sad, as always when a player I like gets shipped out. I’m sure more change will be coming. I’m a little excited that Mr. Tallon isn’t waiting until Feb 28 to get things moving.
I’ll be happy to remember all the changes that take place this year when in 2-3 years I am struggling to come up with the extra money for PLAYOFF TICKETS oh and another chance to sit at a Stanley Cup game!!
COOP
Well, I got my wish the forward lines are certainly shaken up with Frolik gone. I guess this is the best that the Panthers were going to get for him. There were over 8 teams scouting last night, and this was the end result. Frolik’s value certainly was less than I thought.
I wonder if the Panthers will make more trades this week, or is this just a shake up to see if the Panthers will make a run this week?
Before tonight i had alot of faith in Tallon and his "plan". But everything about this trade is wrong, we dont get any draft picks, we get 2 players that will probably never play a game in the NHL, and another who will probably never move above the 3rd line. Maybe we’re just trying to placate Rochester by beefing up their roster.
Tallon either drafted Pacan in 2009 (not sure when Tallon’s last draft in CHI was) or at least knows a lot about Pacan, who’s 19 and is going at about a point per game in the OHL this season. Tallon also knows Skille. The guy knows what he likes and gets what he wants. Soft forwards who avoid contact like the plague (Frolik) do not fit in his plan. (And call me crazy, but this “blueprint” nonsense that’s been all over the place this season and now the backdrop to the official website sounds like a Yormark marketing gimmick all over it, not the scheming of a hockey mind like Tallon).
by kSelvig on Feb 9, 2011 9:50 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Tallon’s last CHI draft was ’09.
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by Donny Rivette on Feb 9, 2011 11:32 PM EST up reply actions
That's a lot of big forwards
6-1, 6-3, 6-6… That’s a lot of muscle roughhousing in the offensive zone (if DeBoer plays ‘em). Won’t miss Frolik so much, really. He seemed always ready to turn the corner but never did. Kind of surprised Tallon didn’t get a pick from Chicago as well.
I wonder if Salak’s departure make Vokoun more or less tradeable. On the face of it, it would seem less… maybe there’s an extension in the works?
Who’s to say DeBoer will be here next season?
COOP
by RPC on Feb 9, 2011 9:44 PM EST up reply actions
Glad you brought that up, I kinda freaked out in the Horton-Wideman trade, I think we got what we really needed in a defenseman and thats all that matters now
Same shock reaction with this trade, but lets see what happens
Gypsy! Give me your tears! If you will not give them to me, I will take them from you!
by Chris S Roberts on Feb 9, 2011 9:48 PM EST up reply actions
Horton didn’t want to be here anymore. Once that happens, you dump him. Immediately. He’s a good player, there’s no denying that.
Although scoring has really suffered this year, I think we got the better player
Gypsy! Give me your tears! If you will not give them to me, I will take them from you!
by Chris S Roberts on Feb 9, 2011 9:55 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I don’t think we got the better player, but I think we got the better fit.
by Craig Fischer on Feb 9, 2011 9:56 PM EST up reply actions
Which means he won’t score again until October.
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by Donny Rivette on Feb 9, 2011 11:33 PM EST up reply actions
We’re adding size and someone to camp in the crease and hopefully score some more goals. It’s a first step.
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We have that, and we’ve either neglected to use it or been to unlucky to see it in action (Bitz).
by Craig Fischer on Feb 9, 2011 9:53 PM EST up reply actions
The one thing I do like about the trade is we received a piece that will be in the lineup right away.
yeah, Frolik was invisible :D
Gypsy! Give me your tears! If you will not give them to me, I will take them from you!
by Chris S Roberts on Feb 9, 2011 9:48 PM EST up reply actions
I like Frolik. When hearing he was traded, I was actually saddened.
And I’m a Flyers fan.
Man-crushin' on Boucher since 1999 and Matt Calvert since May 2010
Broad Street Hockey - Makin' it look mean since 1967.
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Losing Salak hurts more than hurting Frolik
I can understand trading Frolik and a prospect for those 3 players— but Salak tilts this trade in favor of Tallon’s old team. I wrote about it before, and Salak was the Panthers best organizational hope going forward in net. This is theft.
I think we all would have been fine with a Frolik-Skille trade without the prospect BS
Gypsy! Give me your tears! If you will not give them to me, I will take them from you!
by Chris S Roberts on Feb 9, 2011 9:53 PM EST up reply actions
A necessary part of it: for one, Jessiman is needed badly in ROC.
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by Donny Rivette on Feb 9, 2011 10:16 PM EST up reply actions
They liked him so much they loaned him to Sweden and went with Markstrom and Plante? Admittedly, I don’t follow the SEL, let alone the AHL, much, but with Markstrom, Plante, and Chevrie coming up, one of them was going to get left out.
And they left out the best of that bunch. Salak is tearing up the SEL, and last year he took the Americans tot he playoffs, something the now injured Markstrom was not on pace to do.
by Craig Fischer on Feb 9, 2011 9:55 PM EST up reply actions
The question is, have we ever drafted a goalie that has amounted to anything? We’ve had good goaltending for most of the teams history, but its always been acquired talent.
Based on time in the league, Kevin Weekes was the Panthers best ever goaltending draft pick.
by IceCat69 on Feb 9, 2011 10:23 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
That’s probably the winning answer. Can’t argue with his effectiveness when called upon.
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by Donny Rivette on Feb 9, 2011 11:34 PM EST up reply actions
Even at the sports desk for NHL network.
by IceCat69 on Feb 10, 2011 12:51 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
I folloewd Salak in Rochester...
Last year …he had the BEST stats in the AHL for a 2 month period……..The kid loves to mix it up[FIGHT] ..I think Tallon really screwed up getting rid of SALAK…………Flolik…Oh Well………..Craig Fischer you are right on………..This is the first Tallon trade I’m not happy about!.
ROC was a far better team last season, stats-wise; loaded with veterans at every position. Far different story this year.
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by Donny Rivette on Feb 9, 2011 10:14 PM EST up reply actions
Alex Auld!
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by Donny Rivette on Feb 9, 2011 10:06 PM EST up reply actions
Someone asked… ;)
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by Donny Rivette on Feb 9, 2011 10:18 PM EST up reply actions
Im calling the next move…we move someone(weiss) for Tor’s 1st….boston will need him if someone was injured tonight…..krejci got killed in a fight
Boston needs him already. And so does Pittsburgh. Though I think they have the better depth to go for a winger and put someone else at center. Boston might also want to get him and put him with Horton.
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Salak
…keep in mind he’s an RFA on July 1st. As is Frolik.
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Well played ;)
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by Donny Rivette on Feb 9, 2011 10:13 PM EST up reply actions
Tallons big three
1. Bernier, Grabner and 25th pick for Keith Ballard
2. Wideman and 15th pick for Horton, Campbell
3. Frolik and Salak for Skille, prospects
keep in mind that this is the only one without draft picks being involved
Gypsy! Give me your tears! If you will not give them to me, I will take them from you!
by Chris S Roberts on Feb 9, 2011 10:14 PM EST reply actions
Jessiman is not a prospect any longer; finding a home in the A, for which there is no shame, ‘specially since our affiliate needs bodies. And Pacan’s having a terrific season in the O.
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by Donny Rivette on Feb 9, 2011 10:18 PM EST up reply actions
well, I mean not immediately on the roster kind o’ prospect
Gypsy! Give me your tears! If you will not give them to me, I will take them from you!
by Chris S Roberts on Feb 9, 2011 10:19 PM EST up reply actions
There’s nothing wrong with having career AHL players on the roster. Sometimes you need them when people are hurt. And when they’re not, they’re teaching your prospects.
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Litter Box Cats - Your Panthers Colossus.
Bigger question
Is Skille faster then Frolik?
Gypsy! Give me your tears! If you will not give them to me, I will take them from you!
by Chris S Roberts on Feb 9, 2011 10:16 PM EST reply actions
Jessiman isn’t really a prospect, like Clay Wilson or Johnson (I think, remember his rant at the end of last season about how the panthers suck, that guy). Jessiman is a career AHLer.
So we got another Bernier (maybe Skille is a bit better), a career AHLer and a 6th rounder. And worse, what cap space did we save? 1-1.5 million?
I dont think Tallon is going to leave it at that, I smell massive trade on D-Day
Gypsy! Give me your tears! If you will not give them to me, I will take them from you!
by Chris S Roberts on Feb 9, 2011 10:20 PM EST up reply actions
I only expect the unrestricted guys to go, Dvorak, Reasoner, Higgins.
Easy to see how Tallon didn’t like Frolik, he’s been invisible for most of the games that Tallon has seen.
Guess I didn’t finish my point, I only expect the unrestricted guys to go because most of our other players have played up to their standards while Tallons been watching.
I wouldnt entirely like to see reasoner get traded, but McCabe, Vokoun ect might pick up some mighty fine consolation prizes for us
Pending on the Markstrom prognosis though
Gypsy! Give me your tears! If you will not give them to me, I will take them from you!
by Chris S Roberts on Feb 9, 2011 10:27 PM EST up reply actions
I think the only one of those UFA’s i would like to stay around is Dvorak. The only link to our “good days” and still a great defensive forward and penalty kill specialist.
bought his jersey last christmas, I will not be pleased if we trade our all time GP leader for jack skilles…
Gypsy! Give me your tears! If you will not give them to me, I will take them from you!
by Chris S Roberts on Feb 9, 2011 10:31 PM EST up reply actions
Keep in mind a pending UFA can always come back. Doesn’t happen often, but I can see it happening for a guy like Dvorak.
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Thank you John. Couldn’t have said it better.
Had this crazy dream a few weeks ago that Vokoun gets dealt only to return in July. Wishful yes, but possible.
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by Donny Rivette on Feb 9, 2011 11:36 PM EST up reply actions
bleh too much of a bargain on this one
frolik would have brought in much more at the trade deadline, where many many teams desperately find out they need goals and goal scorers
What goals? Its past performance. He didn’t perform this year and his stock has dropped as a result.
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He was still on pace for his usual numbers, he wasn’t playing that bad.
For a rebuilding team it’s strange that Tallon would completey neglect a players talent and value him according to his past performance. The opposite of what he did with Higgins, who has produced less than Frolik this season.
Was on pace for 15 goals, which are 6 short of his totals for the last two years.
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by Donny Rivette on Feb 9, 2011 11:37 PM EST up reply actions
Frolik was a non factor this year, especially in the last months
hard to speculate, but I think Tallon wouldn’t have faired much better at the deadline, less time for a non productive Frolik to fit in with a team heading to the playoffs
Gypsy! Give me your tears! If you will not give them to me, I will take them from you!
by Chris S Roberts on Feb 9, 2011 10:25 PM EST up reply actions
Frolik was a non factor this year, especially in the last months
Frolik was generating more shots per game this year than ever before.
Editor of The Copper & Blue, and leader of The Cult Of Hartikainen.
but he no score!
Gypsy! Give me your tears! If you will not give them to me, I will take them from you!
by Chris S Roberts on Feb 9, 2011 10:44 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Nope. The point is that players will go in slumps. It’s bad luck. But he’s generating more shots which means when the slump ends, he’s generating more goals.
Editor of The Copper & Blue, and leader of The Cult Of Hartikainen.
I understand what you’re saying and I acknowledge your point… but… it feels, to me, just from having watched our games this season, that a lot of our usually-dependable scorers have been “unlucky” this year (I’m thinking of David Booth in particular, here). That, to me, says it really is more than just bad luck. More like a “the team should be running more shooting drills in practice” kind of thing.
I’ll happily admit my opinion is based only on my own observations and anecdotal evidence, and not on numbers (I may go look up Booth’s numbers now, just to see). But it seems, to me, everyone having a “bad luck” slump at the same time is too much to be just coincidence.
Unless the shooters are shooting from farther away, it’s bad luck. They don’t control their shooting percentage, ceteris paribus.
Editor of The Copper & Blue, and leader of The Cult Of Hartikainen.
Ultimately, I think it’s the “ceteris paribus” part of that statement I have issues with. (And not just ‘cause it’s Latin… I went to a prep school, Latin doesn’t scare me!) ;)
so you dont think all the other things are similar to previous seasons?
Rebuild is a convenient excuse for GMs who dont wish to do their jobs
No, I don’t – as I said in my first post on this thread, I think there’s a team-wide affliction when it comes to scoring, especially with some of the guys we usually depend on the most (Frolik & Booth, in particular), and because it’s so widespread, I think it’s more than just simple bad luck.
And as I said above, I freely admit I have no numbers to back that opinion up – just what I think about what I’ve seen on the ice at all the games I’ve attended this season.
his sh% is 5. something this season which is hilariously bad for a forward and wayy lower than his previous 2 seasons. Hence this is a luck based issue. Had his sh% been the same as last season he would hve already scored 14-15 goals.
Derek has shown that his average shot distance is similar to before.
Rebuild is a convenient excuse for GMs who dont wish to do their jobs
alright alright
he gave his all but it was gonna take more then his all to keep him off the trade block
but he’s history now
Gypsy! Give me your tears! If you will not give them to me, I will take them from you!
by Chris S Roberts on Feb 9, 2011 10:49 PM EST up reply actions
So when Deboer is talking about generating 15 scoring chances per game and limiting the opponents to under 15 chances per game, he doesn’t care if that happens and the shots don’t go in?
Editor of The Copper & Blue, and leader of The Cult Of Hartikainen.
lol
More shots yes, he’s much less of a factor than he was the last 2 years though. Less of those shots are from scoring chances.
No. But we have his average shot distance from the last three years
Avg. Shot Distance
32.3’ … 2008-09
33.5’ … 2009-10
33.1’ … 2010-11
And we have his scoring chance percentage from this year: 53%
We have his Corsi numbers from this season.
And we have his zonestarts from this season.
And we have his qualcomp from this season.
His shot distance isn’t moving back away from the net. He’s taking on the toughest competition. He’s getting the toughest zonestarts. He’s got a positive Corsi and he’s winning the scoring chances battle.
He just turned 23 years old.
I don’t care who thinks he’s soft, you don’t beat the toughs with his zonestart at 22 unless you’re a damned good player. He’s a damned good player.
Editor of The Copper & Blue, and leader of The Cult Of Hartikainen.
He’s been beating the toughs since he was a rookie:
http://www.coppernblue.com/2010/5/3/1455867/the-best-forwards-in-the-nhl-tough
Editor of The Copper & Blue, and leader of The Cult Of Hartikainen.
Frolik is soft. Jack Skille is not. Plus he shows the effort where Frolik does not. Keep the flash and bring on the braun. Skille was unfortunately pushed down in Chi town. Frolik avg 50% more TOI. Dale realizes we get back a player that is comparable except add size, grit and charachter. Dont count your chickens yet on this deal.
Agree Salak is a key asset in this deal. Too many assets for the cats at that position. Who do you choose?
Pacan is still an asset unknown. He can score. Still looks a min 3-4 years away IF he makes it.
CFS93
by chesterbardo on Feb 9, 2011 10:32 PM EST via mobile reply actions
Tallon drafted Skille, he obviously believes in him, and perhaps this will give Skille the motivation to really get it going
he has been given a second chance after all
Gypsy! Give me your tears! If you will not give them to me, I will take them from you!
by Chris S Roberts on Feb 9, 2011 10:37 PM EST up reply actions
This is turning into a regular game thread
’cept the sky seems to be falling much more than usual
jk everyone
Gypsy! Give me your tears! If you will not give them to me, I will take them from you!
by Chris S Roberts on Feb 9, 2011 10:34 PM EST reply actions
with 5 minutes left
Gypsy! Give me your tears! If you will not give them to me, I will take them from you!
by Chris S Roberts on Feb 9, 2011 10:35 PM EST up reply actions
Again. Soft. If anyone would take Olesz’s contract, he’d be the next one out. Tallon loves the guys who don’t shy away from contact on the boards.
Gotta wonder if\how much Tallon starts telling DeBoer who to play. Don’t know how much say the coach has in roster moves to begin with, but heading toward the deadline, it’ll be interesting to see where the power lies (or if DeBoer makes it to this summer’s draft).
Well I’ve only seen maybe 2/3 of Repiks games but he initiates lots of contact, he’s not exactly knocking guys out but he plays hungry.
Last game he had a bad giveaway, thats probably why he didn’t get played.
That physical style is precisely the opposite of Frolik this year.
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by Donny Rivette on Feb 9, 2011 11:42 PM EST up reply actions
I think that decision was DeBoer’s, seeing as he benched him last night. Not to say Tallon disagrees, just that it seemed like a coach’s decision.
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Didn’t notice him on Tuesday anyway.
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by Donny Rivette on Feb 9, 2011 11:39 PM EST up reply actions
I did: one time when he hustled & made a good play, and one time when he had a pretty bad turnover. So, kind of a wash, there.
Yeah, there was that little turnover episode…
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by Donny Rivette on Feb 9, 2011 11:45 PM EST up reply actions
I'm done
Gonna sleep on this trade
Doctors should know about Markstrom tomorrow, and I think the future is hanging on him a bit more then Frolik-Skille at the moment
night everyone
Gypsy! Give me your tears! If you will not give them to me, I will take them from you!
by Chris S Roberts on Feb 9, 2011 10:50 PM EST reply actions
This trade does nothing for Florida. We keep hearing about this master plan to get all these young players to build for the future. This trade certainly doesn’t do that. We just saw a bunch of young, sub-par players get traded for each other. The Panthers have assets to use as trade bait for veterans who score goals. They don’t need defense and they don’t need more draft picks and lackluster role players. They need veteran scoring and veteran depth. The panthers are in the playoff hunt. They have two months to make up 8 points to get the 8th seed. This can be done. You all should demand for a playoff push and get rid of this silly idea of building for the future, where you are supposed to get into the playoffs by 2014. The blueprint I see is one that rivals that of the Titanic. Demand that your team gets good now. If Dale Tallon does another trade for crappy players and draft picks, you should demand he be thrown into the gator infested Everglades. John Belushi once said, “What’s all this sitting around here”. Around the league, the Panthers are viewed as a team with ownership who doesn’t give a crap. Get off your butts and show them you want a winner, not a blueprint.
Around the league, the Panthers are viewed as a team with ownership who doesn’t give a crap.
If I may, sir…the reality is quite different.
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by Donny Rivette on Feb 9, 2011 11:41 PM EST up reply actions
Under the radar ain’t always a bad thing, as long as you’re flying in the correct direction
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by Donny Rivette on Feb 9, 2011 11:44 PM EST up reply actions
When they’re not demanding that they be moved to Quebec City or Hamilton, yes.
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As I’ve stated multiple times, my one-word answer to this debate is – once more – Atlanta.
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by Donny Rivette on Feb 9, 2011 11:47 PM EST up reply actions
And promptly sank into obscurity immediately after.
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by Donny Rivette on Feb 10, 2011 12:17 AM EST up reply actions
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