Backlash: "Club Red" and forced (seat) relocation at BankAtlantic Center
by Donny Rivette on Aug 21, 2011 1:42 PM EDT
in Florida Panthers News & Analysis
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As (very) longtime Panthers season seat holders in sections 101, 102, and 134 have received after-the-fact notification of the club's desire to relocate them to "comparable" areas of the building - bulldozing the way for an ultra-exclusive section dubbed "Club Red" - we've received quite a few comments over the past week illustrating the collective anger of a tightly-knit group. Reaction and more after the jump...
A solid backstory can be found via Craig Davis' recent article at the Sun-Sentinel, so we'll recommend giving that a once-over (as well as his follow-up featuring an "official" response by team president Michael Yormark). Our own RPC - a season seat holder within those very same sections - also weighed in several days ago with her FanPost written from a die-hard's perspective.
There are many elements fueling the fire here, not the least of which was the club's push months ago to re-sign patrons (in many cases for two years) in the ultimately affected areas without disclosing their plans, along with the general feeling of being kicked to the curb after having "earned" the seats they've had for so long.
A few reactions by seat holders submitted to LBC...
- "Didn't we finish almost last this year? Have we not made the playoffs for 10 years? Don't we have a whole roster of people who have never played together before and a rookie NHL coach? Isn't the economy about bust? Do the Red Wings, Bruins or any other team have something like this? $20,000 per seat. I have never seen the ADT club full at $10,000 per seat. My 2 seats will go from $6500 to $40,000 next year. Can't we wait until we are a perennial playoff and Stanley Cup winning team?"
- "They are kicking in the teeth some of their most loyal fans."
- "Whether this will work or not from an arena perspective as a business matter is open to debate. But from a Panthers [on-ice product] perspective, it is terrible. Picture this: who will be sitting there (if they are not bright red empties [due to the typical] corporate no-shows)?"
- "They’ve done it again. Unable to sell the ADT section, they are now expanding the concept by kicking out everyone in Section 134, 102, 101 unless they join this all inclusive, VIP, tickets to all events, networking with other successful "south florida individual" club membership."
- "I will either renew in the substitute seats or, more likely, abandon them in disgust. How many slaps can a person take and keep paying their money?"
- "I am outraged at this! We are losing our season seats because they want to build an "exclusive club" where we currently sit. What are they thinking? What happens when the Panthers lose what little fans they actually have left? There are no comparable seats, as the only seats that "match" ours are where the cameramen stand! I mean 50% off isn't going to get us anything close to what we have currently. This club is going to seriously upset many long time season ticket holders and other fans need to know what they are planning to do to the BAC for the 2012-13 season."
- "I really hope this is a [bad] dream and I can keep my seats in Sec [X] Row [X] Seats [X] since I already paid 2 years in advance. About $13,500 for 2 years/2 seats. I guess I could buy 1/2 a seat with the new plan."
- "It’s bull...t. They are prioritizing the arena over the Panthers success and seem to have given up on the Panthers ever being successful enough to support the arena."
Whether the club truly anticipated this type of understandable level of emotion from their paying customers will likely never be revealed, but this marketing strategy is unquestionably not intended to win points with the longtime faithful.
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Whether the club truly anticipated this type of understandable level of emotion from their paying customers will likely never be revealed
Or did they even consider the fans in the first place?
The unaimed arrow never misses
Head Coordinator of the Weaver for Capn campaign
Find me on Twidduh And look at my Marmots
by Chris S Roberts on Aug 21, 2011 2:23 PM EDT reply actions
all the same to him....
I think the older the customer to MY the more insignificant. No appreciation for those who have been so loyal for so long. It’s all about the new money. A new red jersey for those who sign up now. What about those who have been signing up for 18 years? I compute I’ve invested over 100K in tickets since the beginning. Add another $20 avg per game in concessions and/or merchandise. Do the math…another 15K?
CFS93
by chesterbardo on Aug 21, 2011 3:52 PM EDT up reply actions
Yormark and his ilk don’t care about the fans, they care about the big money. They show this repeatedly.
"We don't need the designated goon. Those fights aren't even fun to watch." -Mike Milbury
Litter Box Cats - Your Panthers Colossus.
by John Beatty on Aug 22, 2011 11:31 AM EDT up reply actions
The Panthers are in no position to do this. The Dolphins are the oldest team here, the Heat have been a stellar organization as always (despite current lockout), the Marlins have a new ballpark opening and have succeeded more in the same amount of time than the Panthers. And this should have been an optional upgrade for those sections. Buy the tickets at the current price and if you want the amenities THEN pay extra for them but not as a mandatory price and not at the detriment to the people who are already sitting there. I don’t need a Ph.D. in Marketing to know that.
Fish, Heatles, Cats, Fins, Noles
Why on earth get rid of seats in the lower level and take away seats from people who really want to be at games. There is no reason a club like this needs to be done in the arena. It’s an absolutely pathetic move on Yormarks part. The economy is in such a mess right now and to be asking people to shell out money like that is nuts! I’m so sick of all the stupid marketing in the arena. They should be focused on putting a winner on the ice, something that hasn’t happend in 11 yrs. Yes the red seats were a good idea and maybe us spending money on an up to date scoreboard but seats that cost more then the average person’s salary for the year is plain dumb! I don’t even sit in that section but it bothers me. How do all these plans pass without people’s approval. I know the subject of uniforms doesn’t compare to spending all that money on a seat but if people were actually allowed to vote on whether or not we wanted those ugly light blue jerseys, there wouldn’t have been so much backlash. The problem with this organization has always been that they never ask the fans what they think
Dara
Has anybody thought of bombarding Cliff Viner’s business in Boca with Emails and phone calls about this? Would really get noticed if a mistake in one of his businesses is interfering with the other.
Fish, Heatles, Cats, Fins, Noles
Actually contacting Cliff Viner isn’t a bad idea! He is a really down to earth man and I’m sure would be interested in hearing everyone’s opinion. He isn’t just the owner, he is a true fan of the panthers
Dara
When you need a revolution, you know who to look to.
Fish, Heatles, Cats, Fins, Noles
by National Mario on Aug 21, 2011 4:14 PM EDT up reply actions
Short sightedness is a Yormark hallmark. Alienate your real fanbase and court the big wigs over the regular fans who actually appreciate your product.
As a STH since 1994, I’m thankful I made the choice to move out of 134 and head upstairs with a game package before I knew of this. I’d be livid right now if it happened to me since I had those seats for 8-9 years.
Florida Panthers, Good Hockey, Great Sponsors!! Panthers STH since 1994 and Lightning STH since 2011.
I can't put it on Sun Sent page
Club Red is an insult to Panther Fans. Dear Mr. Yormark, can you please provide the press with actual documentation of your focus group regarding this Club? Can you also advise where the funds for the construction are coming from? Whom exactly are the season ticket holders who are happy with being relocated? To say that something in the price range of $17,500 × 2 × 2 years= $70K is within a Panther Fan’s reach and not focused towards large corporate accounts and those great ticket resellers is just a lie. Perhaps enough fan backlash will wake up the ownership and those influential in the building (Mr. Tallon & Mr. Santos) to take a step back and rethink this atrocious plan.
Be impeccable with your word, don't take anything personally, don't make assumptions, always do your best...
This is a disgraceful move by the franchise and it’s managers. At a time when fan excitement for the upcoming season is higher than it’s been in many, many years, the long-time carpet is ripped out from underneath many faithful season ticket holders.
Frankly, the on-ice performance and playoff drought be damned… this is the type of behavior that makes this franchise the laughing stock of the league.
Out of Craig Davis' article directly.... All rights go to him.
“Michael Yormark, president and COO of the Panthers and SSE. “We did do focus groups, we talked to our season-seat holders. This was not something that was done in haste.”
Yormark said a decision hasn’t been made to go ahead with Club Red but could come by the end of the month. There would be 672 seats in the area. The change would affect about 180 current account holders who occupy about 360 seats in the area, according to the Panthers."-
If this is NOT a done deal, then there is still a chance to get it stopped in its tracks. I for one, am doing some digging and for obvious reasons am not putting my plan of action on this page. Dara & Mario.. I’m in for calling Mr. Viner’s office and giving him the fans perspective. In the end it will have to be an overwhelming flood of calls/emails/media to be heard and we need the support of all folks who have been upset by a lack of customer care/service handed to all us loyal fans. Which writer for the Panthers would support us?
Be impeccable with your word, don't take anything personally, don't make assumptions, always do your best...
George Richards of the miami herald seem pretty cool! I know a bunch of people who would totally support what ever people decided to do. Also, why not post on comments on the papers, panthers facebook pages, send emails….Email yormark, over and over…yormarkm@sselive.com. I too have been a panther faithful…being going to games since the beginning and have sat at every home game, even this awful season last yr where I saw 1 goal a game, haha…With all the hype around this season and all the changes, leave it to yormark to put a damper on it before it even starts. Also where do all these focus groups come from because I am never one of them! I am so involved with everything pertaining to the panthers and I have never been asked anything!
Dara
Wake up people he would do this even if we sold out every game.
"A year from now, or two years from now when the Panthers are back in the playoffs and we’re selling out every game, to move forward with a transition like this in a situation where you’re already sold out would be very challenging. Now’s the right time to do it," Yormark said. Sun Sentinel
Can you believe this arrogance!
This is a selfish person who has his own agenda to line his pockets and Hob Nob with the upper echelon. It doesn’t even matter to him if we are sold out. It will just make it more difficult to accomplish.
I knew I remembered seeing that this renovation was going to be a bill to the tax payers of Broward County. Although not confirmed, Tea Party Republican Allen West supports this plan. I thought the Tea Party was against goverment spending on frivolous agenda’s. I hope the link works.
Be impeccable with your word, don't take anything personally, don't make assumptions, always do your best...
Typical. They borrow money from the county for “renovations” and only build more exclusive clubs. The carpet in the main concourses are so ratty that they’re taped to cover the holes. But the club level looks great.
"We don't need the designated goon. Those fights aren't even fun to watch." -Mike Milbury
Litter Box Cats - Your Panthers Colossus.
by John Beatty on Aug 22, 2011 11:35 AM EDT up reply actions
I actually wrote a letter to West back when SS&E went to the county asking for a handout. Never got a response. I called him out on his supposed “gov’t spending too much” rhetoric and informed him how the organization now known as SS&E has never given a penny to the county after the initial season. I also said, that the money would only go towards high end clientele, not the common tax payer. Still nothing.
by MrOmnipotent on Aug 23, 2011 8:14 PM EDT up reply actions
Good and Bad
I do not want to anger anyone over this post but there has been some good to go along with all of the bad.
GOOD
- No charge for parking in years. I cannot think of any other arena or stadium that offers this.
- Cheaper seats have remained cheap. Most of the upper deck is a bargain except, maybe for the first row. The $25 lower bowl seats are a good value.
BAD
- The team has been so poor for so long it is hard to keep a good local fan base. Sure we get good crowds on many games but how many of those fans are Panther’s fans?
- It really does stink that the team does not offer the same “gift” to returning season ticket holders that they do to new ones. Would it kill them to give the new RED jersey to us season ticket holders that have been spending thousands of dollars each year on a very poor product?
- We used to get some promotion games now we are lucky to get any.
- Would it be possible to get cheaper smaller portions of food?
- It really is a shame what they are doing to these sections. WOuld it kill them to grandfather the loyal season seat holders and not force a 9X increase?
I can go on and on here.
Sad
That after such a great offseason for this club, this has to cast a dark cloud over us. We have to fight and try to prove that there are fans in Florida to northerners and now we have to do the same to our management. That is at least how I am viewing this.
A lil thunder and a lil lightning is what the Cats are going to bring this year.
This is depressing me. I was so psyched for the new season, now I could care less. I am normally a turn that tude around sort of person but I just can’t seem to do it. I hope that the plans for this Club fall apart!
Be impeccable with your word, don't take anything personally, don't make assumptions, always do your best...
Cliff Viner: Publicly Endorse or Kill Club Red
Dear Mr. Viner,
You talk to us when you have something good to say, but we haven’t heard from you about Club Red. You portray yourself as a fan, but you are not one of us if you do not understand how morally reprehensible this disenfranchisement is. Loyalty returned with the back of a hand.
Look, we’ve been asked to be patient (time and time again). That building a sustainable winner doesn’t happen all at once. Well neither does the financial success of the Panthers, so you may have to invest a while…like we have. Club Red is, at this time, given its consequences, an extreme measure intended to maximize revenue. It is not patient at all; it is not what you are asking of us. Selling out the arena by building a sustainable winner is the payoff of the patience you ask of us. Do that first. Prove to us that you are willing to give what you ask of us. Maybe, there will be no need for a Club Red after all…unless the goal is to make as much as you can, instead of as much as you need.
So, after all, this is a moral issue. It is about the relationship between you and us. Your public image is that of the good guy, honest guy, panthers fan, and Chairman of the Panthers Foundation—which depends on us to support its endeavors. And because it is a moral issue, we demand that you speak to it. If you endorse this action, you must say so publicly. It is wrong to maintain your image with us by staying above the fray and letting Mr. Yormark play the role of Dr. Evil. Mr. Viner, we know the buck stops with you; you own this decision, however it goes down.
On the other hand, if you have doubts about whether it is right, kill it for now. Although Dr. Yormark says the time to do it is now because if we start winning there will be no place to move these seat holders because the arena will be too full, would that really be such a bad problem to have?
Imagine building in this market a sustainable winner, a loyal fan base that sells out every game, for hockey(!)… in South Florida! Now that is an accomplishment to be proud of, and the value of the franchise will reflect it. You ask us to believe; show us you do as well.
What is not sustainable are attempts to build it quickly with flash in the pan, Hail Mary’s, that try to co-opt the wealthy with greater and greater lavishness. You can’t keep up with the Joneses on lavishness and hippness; someone else will always beat you by being more lavish, hipper or celebritized. We’ve seen this time and time again in the fly by night South Florida market.
But they can’t beat you on fan loyalty.
If one keeps one’s head in the right place, and one’s vision clear, the decisions come easily. We’ve bought into your publicly stated vision for the Panthers. Now, we are asking, was it real or just marketing? Please let us know by speaking to this issue now. We think you owe it to us. We demand it.
Yours truly,
The Panther Nation
by SHOUT IT! on Aug 23, 2011 8:10 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Very well said! Isn’t the ADT club enough…Why move people who tend to be not even real fans down low and take away seats from people who really want to sit there! For once it would be nice if the arena was actually just full of hockey fans (panthers ones) and we didn’t have to do stupid marketing schemes…
Dara
As a season ticket holder in a section that is not effect by this, part of me wants to call my ticket guy and let him know that if this goes thru I won’t renew as well. I believe if we all did this no matter where we sat, let our ticket reps know, maybe we can cause some type of riple effect. The way I see it all Panthers fans are on the same boat and in this thing together.
A lil thunder and a lil lightning is what the Cats are going to bring this year.
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